Petition for release of source code!

[FallenLeader]

provide me with the proper information and i will send them a letter asking some questions about the game and if they are making a K&M 2
or something stupid and easy to answer like that.

[merchant_992]

Maybe we should try fishing for an other game. They seem to ignore anything about KaM. Maybe ask something about 2worlds?

[Quelle]

Intresting ^^
How to ask for KaM source code with 2Worlds in the subject line?

[merchant_992]

Fishing. Ask them something and see if they reply. In that case they are checking their mail, but haven't answered about the petition yet.

[Lewin]

I was thinking maybe we should email someone else in the company. Maybe just Mr. Hassinger is ignoring us. I'm fairly certain he's still checking his emails.

I therefore just sent a message to a few of the other addresses for ZuXXeZ explaining the situation in depth.

Hopefully SOMEONE will reply.

I'm not too sure about the fishing idea, we don't want to annoy them.
Lewin.

[merchant_992]

Then I guess it's waiting again.

[Lewin]

I got an email from another member of staff at ZuXXeZ less than 24 hours after sending the message. He says he will remind Mr. Hassinger and get back to me ASAP!
Fingers crossed...
Lewin.

[Nick]

more news? :p

[Lewin]

Nope. I haven't received any further contact. I won't nag them again for quite a while yet, the last email sounded quite hopeful and apologetic.

I will let you know here as soon as I have any more news.

[merchant_992]

Probably best to wait for a month again. If we still have no answer after that, try another mail to the same person that answered your latest mail.

[Quelle]

Cant wait for the andwer^^

But waiting a month is probably the best idea

[The Knight]

A month? The 2 guys work in the same OFFICE! I think...

BTW if we get the source code, it needs also much time, until our programmer have read the code and understand it! Also they don't get help from peter ohlmann! So, i would wait for Kroms Remake or Beta 7 patch instead.

[Lewin]

@TK: Beta 7 patch has little to do with the source code. How will waiting for it be equal to getting the source code? Litude (who is making it) cannot reprogram KaM and fix the bugs, that requires the source code. Obviously a complete remake would be best, although it might take some time. And we don't just want the source code to reprogram KaM and fix the bugs, it will be very useful for the remake projects to assist with design the decoding of the data files.

And now for the news: Yesterday I got a reply from Dirk Hassinger:

Hello Lewin,

we currently have no intention to release any source code of any of our
games. We do not see any advantages for us. Furthermore, it is quite
possible, that someone ports such code to another platform and later on
claims rights for the results.

Best regards,

Dirk P. Hassinger
board chairman

This is crushing news, but don't give up hope yet! Notice that he didn't say: "we will never release the code", just that they see no advantage for them. I can understand their point. From a purely business point of view releasing the source code is a time consuming and potentially risky thing to do with no commercial benefits.

We now need to decide on the next best course of action. Here are some ideas I had:
- Point out that porting the game would still be illegal if they provide a license with the source code forbidding commercial use.
- Suggest possible reasons why it would be an advantage for them (e.g. bugs/stability fixed making the game more popular today)
- Offer a payment for the source code from donations from fans. I for one would be willing to pay an amount and so might other people, but please don't feel you have an obligation!
- Say that it would give them a good name as a company if they work in collaboration with fan communities? (just a random idea)

Please give more suggestions and comments, and discuss what we should do next.

Please stay hopeful!
Lewin.

[merchant_992]

1 We don't need the rights for the game. Just the possibility to change parts of the source. Porting would idd be illegal.
2 Is a point, but probably not good enough for them. Not much chance more people wil buy the game.
3 Payment will be very hard to do.
4 True. That is the big advantage for the company. Assure them that in every patch or mod their names will be mentioned. That they gave us their help.

[Litude]

This is crushing news, but don't give up hope yet! Notice that he didn't say: "we will never release the code", just that they see no advantage for them. I can understand their point. From a purely business point of view releasing the source code is a time consuming and potentially risky thing to do with no commercial benefits.

Trying to read between the lines, it sounded more like the part he didn't like is that he probably thinks that a source code release = freeware release of the game (seeing as they're still selling it, it'd be a definite no in their books). Obviously that isn't the case, though looking at e.g. Doom or Quake the piracy numbers probably skyrocketed once the source code was released (you'd be surprised how many people at least claim they thought the games were freeware). Then again, the Quake 3 source code actually included the CD-key generation code (naturally it had to) which probably didn't help too much either.

- Point out that porting the game would still be illegal if they provide a license with the source code forbidding commercial use.

I think he considered this, but if someone releases a product based on KaM source code and keeps it closed source it's hard to prove the product is using the source. Then again I don't really understand who would try to make a commercial product based on 10 year old source code?

- Suggest possible reasons why it would be an advantage for them (e.g. bugs/stability fixed making the game more popular today)

In the case that they'd release the source code without making the game itself freeware (with the construction KaM uses it could be a bit difficult) you'd think it would lead to boosted sales, at least if someone actually did something with the source code.

- Offer a payment for the source code from donations from fans. I for one would be willing to pay an amount and so might other people, but please don't feel you have an obligation!

Highly doubt this would work, purchasing the source code of a game would probably require some $100,000 so unless someone here has won the lottery I think we can forget about that.

- Say that it would give them a good name as a company if they work in collaboration with fan communities? (just a random idea)

Here I have to be honest, ZuXXeZ product support is almost non-exsistant (I have to say I was surprised that Two Worlds recieved as many patches as it did, I guess it sold too well to allow ignoring). Well I guess we all know that TPR is bugridden, but the more important fraiche to ZuXXeZ, the Earth series have always been known for having massive amounts of bugs and generally ZuXXeZ has made a bad name for themselves by releasing buggy products and then doing little to please the fanbase in form of patches or other stuff. Source code releases usually give quite a friendly image of a company so they could at least partly clean their name by releasing the source code.


But the question I'm really wondering about is whether it would be possible in a practical way to release the source code without making the game itself freeware?