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Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 06:35
by Tiank
I like the idea and I think all of you (Sado, To, woloszek, andreus, Ben, TDL) are the right people for this job. I was surprised to seeing Pawel on list as well, but sado's argument make sense.
Maybe you should make one forum account for map comitee (so player don't have to write to each of you), as well as own e-mail adress on kamremake.com. I have a feeling, that inbox could be filled very fast when it comes to maps, so you should keep it well organised
.
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 07:08
by Skypper
It think it is a good idea.
Will the current maps in the remake also be reviewd ?
because there are some maps, that are defenatly not remake worthy
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 09:02
by sado1
It think it is a good idea.
Will the current maps in the remake also be reviewd ?
because there are some maps, that are defenatly not remake worthy
Yes. Look at the second part of my post, I might've not been clear enough, but I meant the maps that are in the Remake already there.
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 12:18
by andreus
Yep. Special account is good idea
some people might be surprised to see Pawel on the list (I am surprised
) since he never made a map xD But on a second thought, he might be a good person to judge SP maps.
He could judge SP maps and coop maps (especially my coop TSK/TPR maps
).
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 14:55
by pawel95
some people might be surprised to see Pawel on the list (I am surprised
) since he never made a map xD But on a second thought, he might be a good person to judge SP maps.
Comeon Sado. Ok I might be the wrong person to judge maps in their lookings as an example, but you should know from my campaign fixes, that I like, if a map works like it should (
mostly sp, because in mp there is nothing that "should work"). So things like static scripts /AI behaviour should be ok to watch over for me and judge it and please do not forget about my love to tactic maps and the Strategy Part of kam in general
I have given already many tips to mapmakers for their fighting maps (I think I also did so with your Conquest Sado
) about how to improve the fun in great battles. However I am also surprised
EDIT: After I thought a minute about it. The judging people haven´t to been really "pro mapmakers". If I just watch TeamSpeak and see people like Romek for example, not from the good looking aspect, but mostly about the balance/possibility to build a nice city. He could be one of the best people judging multiplayer economy maps just to say if it´s totaly "kupa" or "dobra robota".
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 15:51
by Ben
I don't really think it is important that such a committee have experience making maps. In fact, I think that it is almost irrelevant. What's more important is that the player is very knowledgeable about game mechanics. You can make a dozen maps and still be naïve about game mechanics.
Send me flame, but people are mentioning names so I will too: I disagree with the people being proposed. Sado, woloszeck, and andreus are bad choices (imo!). It would be more advantageous to have To, (valuable because he knows how to make maps as well) Romek, Matt, or Mulberry. Of course, getting such a group together is impossible; I'm just giving examples.
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 17:02
by sado1
On the other hand though, I don't know where should we aim: cause even if we want to eliminate (for example) campy maps from the game, can we really? It is not our choice what people want to play. So do we judge the looks only, or also the gameplay?
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 17:07
by pawel95
So do we judge the looks only, or also the gameplay?
That was the point of me and a bit of Ben also, if I understodd it correctly
In fact, I think that it is almost irrelevant. What's more important is that the player is very knowledgeable about game mechanics.
To answer your question. In my opinion the job of such a committee is both! It doesn´t help you if it´s a brilliant looking map but unplayable, because of fighting space/building space etc. Also such a committee should be really objective. That means: Don´t ban maps looking close to Cursed Ravine, just because you don´t like it and they are "campy maps" on the first look, without testing
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 17:09
by sado1
So what makes a map unplayable? Apart from obvious things like, I don't know, open up The Duckland and see xD
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 18:03
by Krom
How about sports scoring system - 5+ judges, each specializing in its field (visuals, balance) saying thier scores on important maps properties (looks, balance, fun, etc) and then 1 highest and one lowest scores in each property are thrown out. This way you can avoid bias and also have a combined map score
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 18:22
by andreus
So what makes a map unplayable? Apart from obvious things like, I don't know, open up The Duckland and see xD
hmm.. any thing which kills fun of gameplay
For example map with narrow entrances and mass ranged... (yep it's obvious
)
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 19:37
by sado1
So what makes a map unplayable? Apart from obvious things like, I don't know, open up The Duckland and see xD
hmm.. any thing which kills fun of gameplay
For example map with narrow entrances and mass ranged... (yep it's obvious
)
OK, so we say narrow entrances kill gameplay, what if the author says "randoms will like it"? How can you define "fun" in a way that will make everyone agree?
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 20:29
by andreus
Don't know what to say
I meant narrow entrances + mass bowmen kill fun personally for me. But yep, agree, someone can like this gameplay...
It's impossible to make map "for everyone", anyway there can be found people which dislike it.
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 10 Apr 2014, 23:20
by thunder
Hm. I just noticed to this topic is here:S
Well, this team creation is heavy issue. The best or pros almost everytime playing the same maps, or rather almost the same gameplay. 60pt 1x1x... this isalready determinating maps...
Every mapmakers have a style. These styles are taste of their maps. For example
To's wide entrances, koczis's golden mountains, Paker team's idea, TDL classical&wonderful style, thunder'S not normal ways...and etc
I could advice only a quality and balance checking. Deleting a map because seems unplayable for a pro player...just "bikakaki". There are player whose playing fun mode. Ive seen players who made 500 farms and another 3000buildings on a map and he liked to watch that...so this is always hard what would you like to install.
Personaly sometimes im just boring because the normal games are only on normal maps.
More maps more colorful Remake. If there are too much maps make more categories,i dont think that 20MB will be counting. This isnt that century already where the game have to be on 1floppy disc...
Re: List of new maps to be included
PostPosted: 11 Apr 2014, 13:54
by Kirelareus
I don't really think it is important that such a committee have experience making maps. In fact, I think that it is almost irrelevant. What's more important is that the player is very knowledgeable about game mechanics. You can make a dozen maps and still be naïve about game mechanics.
Send me flame, but people are mentioning names so I will too: I disagree with the people being proposed. Sado, woloszeck, and andreus are bad choices (imo!). It would be more advantageous to have To, (valuable because he knows how to make maps as well) Romek, Matt, or Mulberry. Of course, getting such a group together is impossible; I'm just giving examples.
So funny, my friend. But, IMO, ppls who can't make good maps (Mulberry bueeh, Matt and etc) shouldn't decide it.
About Andreus and Woloszek - they're professionals in mapmaking. Andreus's maps aren't worse than Sado's and To's