Knights and Merchants.net Forum

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 11:57**

And why do we have an idea-topic if ideas which more people like are directly lashed away?

Normal argumentative positions would be nice, not an NO!. Explain what you don´t want and why.
And why cannot be new ideas be added then, i mean it´s a remake, as it says in the title, and for example the market was added too. Of course some ideas (nuclear weapons) are very strange, no i would say dump, but we could make it like in minecraft with one different:

Add a button with "play with mods".
Then a button "Mods", that will open a list, were you can put your mods (not the script, the datas, like .rar´s or else). Then you have no problem with this anymore and everybody can write his own mod, maybe unlimited res, maybe play with town hall.

Would that be a possibility?
GR
MaxDeus

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 12:00**

Normal argumentative positions would be nice, not an NO!. Explain what you don´t want and why.

I don't know if you read Lewin's post, but how many arguments do you want, lol?

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 12:04**

I do not mean lewins post, this was a good one. But in fact, if some now ideas are comming up, noone can give good reasons why this should not be implemented.

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 12:17**

@MaxDeus: Because even simplest ideas alike Speedup are splitting MP lobbies into x1 and x2 camps. We don't want to add 10 more settings to get 20+ different camps each with just a few people in it, arguing about which settings should be On/Off. Another reason is that we try hard to keep KaM experience consistent and solid, without hundreds of small titbits enabled via checkboxes. That is why many minor features get rejected. And of course we are guarding hard against big ideas akin to "nuclear weapons" and such. They don't have place in KaM universe.

On the other hand, one could make an extensive list of features that were proposed, polished and added in Remake

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 12:22**

Okay. I´ll take your words and make a list of "mods" that would fit into KaMRemake. Give me a few days. After that we can start a discussion so that we can all decide. Would this a good idea?

GR
MaxDeus

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 12:31**

@MaxDeus: It would be a good idea to have this long list of suggested ideas and why they were turned over or accepted. So that we have hard facts for those who complain we don't implement nothing and we save time on rejecting duplicates

Making a list of mods you think fit into KMR (those already mentioned here and rejected) would just waste yours and ours time.

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 13:31**

We get lots of ideas suggested, and while it would be nice to provide a long and detailed argument about why we don't want to implement it, that would be wasting a lot of our time which we could be spending coding. There are already 1941 posts in the topic, and this is just one source of ideas we get (there's also other topics, email, Facebook, TeamSpeak, etc.). Usually it's not practical for us to provide more than a short reason for rejecting an idea because there are so many suggestions.

We end up hearing the same ideas over and over, or we hear ideas that are all rejected for similar reasons. We get tired of repeating ourselves so we get lazy and write shorter responses. We could keep some kind of list of suggestions with explanations, but the list would end up being massive and maintaining it would end up wasting a lot of time.

Why do we have an ideas forum? Because we often get really good suggestions here and implement them into the game

But at least 50% (probably more) of the ideas suggested here are never going to be implemented. Even if 90% of the ideas here are rejected we still get the best 10% of ideas implemented into the game, and that's definitely worthwhile.

People get frustrated when we reject their ideas. But imagine if every KaM Remake player (about 50,000 based on number of downloads) suggested an idea and expected us to implement it? Clearly that's not very practical. At the end of the day the KaM Remake is Krom and my project so we decide what direction it goes in and what features get implemented. If anybody wants to fork our open source repository and make their own version of the KaM Remake with their own ideas, they are welcome to.

Please read my post on the previous page for a description of why we are hesitant to accept ANY new ideas in general, even ones that are not bad (but not great).

Perhaps we need a post in this forum about why ideas are usually rejected (with a list of common/general reasons)?

PostPosted: **16 Jan 2014, 19:00**

Perhaps we need a post in this forum about why ideas are usually rejected (with a list of common/general reasons)?

Or maybe you all should just could describe the type or nature of the suggestions you are looking for...those that are not too time consuming to implement and costly to maintain in the far future. That would be much simpler on your part. I'm sure you both knew that this project would be time-consuming, so implementation of new ideas will naturally be time consuming. If you all are having problems maintaining now, I would advise you both to try to get all of that fixed before releasing yet another build.

In fact, maybe you and Krom should take a break from this project and resume in a few months (or years), to have balance in your lives. We all respect the both of you and are grateful for the time you all have put into this project, but on the other side of the coin, we should be told to not waste OUR time trying to improve the game if we all don't have the same idea of what it means to improve the game (in terms of convenience for you guys) to begin with.

PostPosted: **17 Jan 2014, 06:02**

Perhaps we need a post in this forum about why ideas are usually rejected (with a list of common/general reasons)?
Or maybe you all should just could describe the type or nature of the suggestions you are looking for...those that are not too time consuming to implement and costly to maintain in the far future. That would be much simpler on your part. I'm sure you both knew that this project would be time-consuming, so implementation of new ideas will naturally be time consuming. If you all are having problems maintaining now, I would advise you both to try to get all of that fixed before releasing yet another build.

One could make such a list by comparing suggested ideas to KaM Remake changelog. We have long-stretch ideas (Unicode, AI, Spectators, etc). It is our goal also to stick to the remake part, not the upgrade. That means we are likely to judge every idea against TSK - would it fit there without changing the game too much?

It depends on what kind of maintenance you mean.

That's what we are doing usually. Release > Fixes > Big features > Smaller features > Fixes > Release Candidate > Polishing > Release > and so on

In fact, maybe you and Krom should take a break from this project and resume in a few months (or years), to have balance in your lives. We all respect the both of you and are grateful for the time you all have put into this project, but on the other side of the coin, we should be told to not waste OUR time trying to improve the game if we all don't have the same idea of what it means to improve the game (in terms of convenience for you guys) to begin with.

If someone made that list of ideas accepted and rejected, maybe we could continue this discussion without blaming us for not implementing each and every idea you guys suggest.

PostPosted: **17 Jan 2014, 13:38**

In fact, maybe you and Krom should take a break from this project and resume in a few months (or years), to have balance in your lives.

I don't think that's a good idea. They should dedicate their lives to the Remake and improve it for our wellbeing!

PostPosted: **17 Jan 2014, 13:43**

I split Islar's discussion about a new scripted multiplayer map since it's not about the KaM Remake itself. You can find the new topic here:
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=2018

PostPosted: **19 Jan 2014, 17:10**

Maybe for the next release: If you want someone to attack another player again and again but first after maybe 55 minutes and then every 10 minutes for example.
(I cannot make it work without dynamic scrpit till now, and maybe this is not function, i never tested it).

In other words: Player 7 attacks after 10 minutes. If you make it with the editor, player 7 will attack every 10 minutes. But what is if i want him to attack the first time maybe after 55 minutes, and then every 10 minutes? So that you add a field with: time the attack will start at. and than it can be repeated.

GR
MaxDeus

PostPosted: **19 Jan 2014, 17:43**

Just checking in on something I asked a long time ago: Will we be able to mute the chat of other players in the next release? It's really annoying when people spam the chat...

PostPosted: **21 Jan 2014, 06:59**

@MaxDeus: You can do that without dynamic scripts already. You can make the AI equip soldiers fast enough to be able to attack every 10 minutes (with a repeating AI attack) and then set the recruit delay so they don't start training any recruits until 55 minutes (so the first attack won't be triggered until then because they won't have enough troops). It's not possible to make an AI attack occur exactly every 10 minutes since the trigger is based off the number of soldiers the AI has, but by adjusting the equip rate you should be able to get it close.

Just checking in on something I asked a long time ago: Will we be able to mute the chat of other players in the next release? It's really annoying when people spam the chat...

Do you mean hiding chat of individual players, or of all players, or just disabling the sound? Disabling the sound would be ok but I don't like the idea of hiding chat from other players because it discourages team player and socialising, and chat messages without sound are easy to ignore anyway.

PostPosted: **21 Jan 2014, 07:56**

@MaxDeus: You can do that without dynamic scripts already. You can make the AI equip soldiers fast enough to be able to attack every 10 minutes (with a repeating AI attack) and then set the recruit delay so they don't start training any recruits until 55 minutes (so the first attack won't be triggered until then because they won't have enough troops). It's not possible to make an AI attack occur exactly every 10 minutes since the trigger is based off the number of soldiers the AI has, but by adjusting the equip rate you should be able to get it close.

Just checking in on something I asked a long time ago: Will we be able to mute the chat of other players in the next release? It's really annoying when people spam the chat...
Do you mean hiding chat of individual players, or of all players, or just disabling the sound? Disabling the sound would be ok but I don't like the idea of hiding chat from other players because it discourages team player and socialising, and chat messages without sound are easy to ignore anyway.

I think he means hiding chat of individuals and with that mostly the enemy. Some guys are spamming the [all] chat in a language I don't get. I think that disabling the sounds would make you miss things your ally said.

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