Ideas - New Units and Buildings (Brainstorming)

[Shadaoe]

Most of the ideas here, even if they are pretty good, would fit better in a mod (if ever a modding system would be implemented) than in the remake, not everyone might like this :/
I think most of SirCabbage's ideas are interesting, but, in my mind, I can only see them in a "Realistic mod" :p

[SirCabbage]

I agree, a moddable/togglable system would be the only way to implement them. The checklist would be the best way- I hope it gets done

[kamil]

There are some good ideas. Is there a plan for putting any them into the game?

[Krom]

It all depends on how much the ideas are thought-through and have a person(s) working on them both on theoretical and practical sides.

Out of 100 guys with ideas only dozen will actually start working on them and only few will have enough stamina to finish what they've started.

[SirCabbage]

I am still here- I may not be a programmer but ill always be about to help with the theoretical aspects of my idea, and ideas on how to implement. I still fully support my ideas and my desire to see them in this game

I just wish I could do more, Like, if I knew how I could help with the implementation. What would need to be written about "x" or "y" to have it put in the manual for the game, or, what kinds of flavour text or similar. I really want to see my ideas implemented as options (not compulsory) so much.

[thabes]

I have started to play KAM remake about 1 month. I really appricate effort of Lewin and Kroms. Thansk a lot.

However I would like to say some of my ideas to improve game quality!

1) you remove the siege workshop, catapult and balista which are the only good difference of the peasant rebellion from the formal KAM. İf you want to improve something until you find better, its better to keep original one. But you deleted totally. If you think it should be controlled by someone, I think the guys should be crossbowmans to set it up.

2) When we play the multiplayer games I realized that after we spent an hour to built economy, the game only finish in 10 minutes because everybody leaves the game due to loosing buildings or troops. Then the game is only seems just built economy.

3) I think there should be an option to built a wall anyplace we want. But ıt can cost 10 stone or something for each section. Then we can adjust our strategy.

4) Another think is hunting. we should hunt like wild animals such as pigs or deers and use their meat and skin as well. I think like wood cutter man and his house appropriate for it.

5) If we want to improve game there should be many options like Age of empires, such as trading ships, war ships or the city we destroyed get their storehouse etc.

6) an improve units war experience. For example the units who enter the war and survive can live longer than the others.

These are my ideas. Maybe they are stupid but İf you can do it, KAM remake would become like meal which is very delicious.

Best regards

[T*AnTi-V!RuZz]

I have started to play KAM remake about 1 month. I really appricate effort of Lewin and Kroms. Thansk a lot.

However I would like to say some of my ideas to improve game quality!

1) you remove the siege workshop, catapult and balista which are the only good difference of the peasant rebellion from the formal KAM. İf you want to improve something until you find better, its better to keep original one. But you deleted totally. If you think it should be controlled by someone, I think the guys should be crossbowmans to set it up.

2) When we play the multiplayer games I realized that after we spent an hour to built economy, the game only finish in 10 minutes because everybody leaves the game due to loosing buildings or troops. Then the game is only seems just built economy.

3) I think there should be an option to built a wall anyplace we want. But ıt can cost 10 stone or something for each section. Then we can adjust our strategy.

4) Another think is hunting. we should hunt like wild animals such as pigs or deers and use their meat and skin as well. I think like wood cutter man and his house appropriate for it.

5) If we want to improve game there should be many options like Age of empires, such as trading ships, war ships or the city we destroyed get their storehouse etc.

6) an improve units war experience. For example the units who enter the war and survive can live longer than the others.

These are my ideas. Maybe they are stupid but İf you can do it, KAM remake would become like meal which is very delicious.

Best regards

Here's my opinion on your ideas:

1) Technically, KaM Remake is (started out as) a TSK Remake, not a TPR Remake. It has a nice few additions now, but they were well thought through. This point was discussed, but it seemed that ballista's were kind of overpowered and other balance issues.

2) Try playing with other players. It's not Lewin and/or Krom's fault they leave within 10 minutes (it means they haven't been preparing enough during peace time).

3) This idea has been discussed and rejected. Walls do not fit the KaM style and you can often use the terrain to defend yourself (which is exactly what is meant to be done).

4) Whoah.. Imagine you were a woodcutter. Just minding your own business when someone comes in and says "Hi.. You're going to hunt animals from now on. Happy hunting!". The hunting idea also doesn't fit KaM. The only thing to hunt is wolves, and there aren't many wolves on the maps. Once you killed 1, you'd have to destroy the building, build a looooong road to the next wolf, build the building again, just to kill 1 wolf.. Doesn't make sense at all.

5) Why? AoE and KaM are completely different games with completely different game styles and cannot be compared. If I wanted trading ships or war ships etc. I'd just go play AoE
The other thing (get their storehouse) isn't such a bad idea and has been discussed in the past. There hasn't really been a decision on that, as far as I know.

6)Like a ranking system? Also doesn't fit KaM imo.

[Bence791]

@thabes

Hm, as it seems, you haven't understood the game mechanics...

1) Why a xbowmen? Why not a serf?
2) Then you haven't seen tough guys who don't give up if loses all his troops.. A good game can last 2 hrs as well..
3) Walls... Read any other topics about walls, I won't write anything here about it..
4) Hunting... Draw animals, then let them move, draw a Hunter's house, draw a Hunter and so on...
5) Ships? LOL. We usually have no timber to produce wooden weapons, and then we should build ships too? Anyway, draw the sprites. Draw 5 kind of ships, let soldiers get overboard, let the ships move, draw Docks etc..
6) In KaM, for example: a Lancer equals another Lancer, an Axeman equals another Axeman and so on.. Hm, a soldier live till he falls on the battlefield, or starves because of no feeding, and I don't really understand what you would mean.

To implement an improve into the game that doesn't mean to copy anything from other games.. Think about the release, play, and look for things which could/should be improved. The team wants to create something different of KaM TSK/TPR, but not a mix of other RTS games. It isn't that simple "oh I saw something cool in another game and you MUST add it because it will be bad and I won't play anymore". An improvement must fit to the game. These don't do, so forget about them.

[Siegfried]

2) When we play the multiplayer games I realized that after we spent an hour to built economy, the game only finish in 10 minutes because everybody leaves the game due to loosing buildings or troops. Then the game is only seems just built economy.

That's the point that's bothering me the most. I think this is a consequence of the fact, that you can't really come back into the game if you lost the first. battle. Of course some people have managed this before, but in so many matches this is not the case.

This is a direct consequence of the fact, that there are no real defending buildings, so you have to rely on your troops which take a long time to build. Towers are no real defense, they only slow down the attack. I don't think you can change this, this comes with the game mechanics.

[Da Revolution]

1. Using stuff because there is no other solution yet...a bit strange. Do you think it has been removed without a reason?
2. See the quote and reaction below.
3. Walls, like anti said "it doesn't fit into the game". I agree with that.
4. Hunting...would be nice indeed, but way too much work. You'll need new animals/building/unit?/reworked inn (or do you think it should look like a pig?).
5. Changing stuff so its more like AoE would be a bad choice since I think AoE isn't a great formula.
6. Would be really unfair. This means the person with the biggest army gets stronger and stronger without leaving any chance for the others.

That's the point that's bothering me the most. I think this is a consequence of the fact, that you can't really come back into the game if you lost the first. battle. Of course some people have managed this before, but in so many matches this is not the case.

Most games I play last at least 1:30. There is replay from 2 days ago that lasted more than 2 hours and where I had to rebuild 3 times (we won).

[thabes]

I have started to play KAM remake about 1 month. I really appricate effort of Lewin and Kroms. Thansk a lot.

However I would like to say some of my ideas to improve game quality!

1) you remove the siege workshop, catapult and balista which are the only good difference of the peasant rebellion from the formal KAM. İf you want to improve something until you find better, its better to keep original one. But you deleted totally. If you think it should be controlled by someone, I think the guys should be crossbowmans to set it up.

2) When we play the multiplayer games I realized that after we spent an hour to built economy, the game only finish in 10 minutes because everybody leaves the game due to loosing buildings or troops. Then the game is only seems just built economy.

3) I think there should be an option to built a wall anyplace we want. But ıt can cost 10 stone or something for each section. Then we can adjust our strategy.

4) Another think is hunting. we should hunt like wild animals such as pigs or deers and use their meat and skin as well. I think like wood cutter man and his house appropriate for it.

5) If we want to improve game there should be many options like Age of empires, such as trading ships, war ships or the city we destroyed get their storehouse etc.

6) an improve units war experience. For example the units who enter the war and survive can live longer than the others.

These are my ideas. Maybe they are stupid but İf you can do it, KAM remake would become like meal which is very delicious.

Best regards

Here's my opinion on your ideas:

1) Technically, KaM Remake is (started out as) a TSK Remake, not a TPR Remake. It has a nice few additions now, but they were well thought through. This point was discussed, but it seemed that ballista's were kind of overpowered and other balance issues.

2) Try playing with other players. It's not Lewin and/or Krom's fault they leave within 10 minutes (it means they haven't been preparing enough during peace time).

3) This idea has been discussed and rejected. Walls do not fit the KaM style and you can often use the terrain to defend yourself (which is exactly what is meant to be done).

4) Whoah.. Imagine you were a woodcutter. Just minding your own business when someone comes in and says "Hi.. You're going to hunt animals from now on. Happy hunting!". The hunting idea also doesn't fit KaM. The only thing to hunt is wolves, and there aren't many wolves on the maps. Once you killed 1, you'd have to destroy the building, build a looooong road to the next wolf, build the building again, just to kill 1 wolf.. Doesn't make sense at all.

5) Why? AoE and KaM are completely different games with completely different game styles and cannot be compared. If I wanted trading ships or war ships etc. I'd just go play AoE
The other thing (get their storehouse) isn't such a bad idea and has been discussed in the past. There hasn't really been a decision on that, as far as I know.

6)Like a ranking system? Also doesn't fit KaM imo.

1) Ok undertand that. But you mentioned in other answers writing script for ship and docks and hunting animals are really hard. So for ballista and catapult there is already written script but you didnt use it. For the question is not realistic, so what the people used at that time of the history. at least there should be something different from old KAM.

2) It doesnt matter play with the other players . Even though we spent two hours for building and troops war is finish in 10 minutes. Most of the time overbalanced groups. Even though you said ballista and catapult is not fit the game they can bring new breath and strategy. This version of the game in this sense is very boring and we always do same thing. Built three stone maker, three woodcutter and so on...

3) if the walls are not appropriate and rejected as the idea, Why we see the walls already in there. Sometimes around the castles and the town there are walls. So how they are built. Even though the watch towers useless in some point. Somebody makes many axemen and enter the city very easily. So the walls are very necessary.

4) I didnt mean wood cutter catch them, just like a person wood cutter who can travel and locate the trees, a hunter can find and locate the animals and he can have his own house.

5) What ı mean by that we can travel behind the enemy by using ships and improve strategy quality. We can use them for many purposes.

6) Why it didnt fit, As you see the real cases in the war, a person who has more experience can last longer than the other soldiers.

s

[Krom]

That's the point that's bothering me the most. I think this is a consequence of the fact, that you can't really come back into the game if you lost the first. battle. Of course some people have managed this before, but in so many matches this is not the case.

Thats an interesting thought. Would be interesting to discuss it and come up with some ideas to allow for better survivability.

[thabes]

@thabes

Hm, as it seems, you haven't understood the game mechanics...

1) Why a xbowmen? Why not a serf?
2) Then you haven't seen tough guys who don't give up if loses all his troops.. A good game can last 2 hrs as well..
3) Walls... Read any other topics about walls, I won't write anything here about it..
4) Hunting... Draw animals, then let them move, draw a Hunter's house, draw a Hunter and so on...
5) Ships? LOL. We usually have no timber to produce wooden weapons, and then we should build ships too? Anyway, draw the sprites. Draw 5 kind of ships, let soldiers get overboard, let the ships move, draw Docks etc..
6) In KaM, for example: a Lancer equals another Lancer, an Axeman equals another Axeman and so on.. Hm, a soldier live till he falls on the battlefield, or starves because of no feeding, and I don't really understand what you would mean.

To implement an improve into the game that doesn't mean to copy anything from other games.. Think about the release, play, and look for things which could/should be improved. The team wants to create something different of KaM TSK/TPR, but not a mix of other RTS games. It isn't that simple "oh I saw something cool in another game and you MUST add it because it will be bad and I won't play anymore". An improvement must fit to the game. These don't do, so forget about them.

1) Because if we speak about realisticity, the person who should use the catapult is crossbowmen because He can target the enemy by his arrow so, he can use this features for catabult or ballista.

2) İt doesnt matter 2 hours or 3 hours, only matter is always same strategy and we cannot pull back our troops once they enter the war.

3)ok.

4) It can be done I think

5) Wouldnt it be nice _?

6) I answer this question. at least something should be different about the battle from the previous KAM.


I really appriciate your efforts but there is almost nothing new. Some buildings except market place which almost have no contribution. I f you want to improve the game please consider those things. MAking new map or making good menu is ok but we need more action and controlibilty.

best wishes

[Krom]

1) Ok undertand that. But you mentioned in other answers writing script for ship and docks and hunting animals are really hard. So for ballista and catapult there is already written script but you didnt use it. For the question is not realistic, so what the people used at that time of the history. at least there should be something different from old KAM.

2) It doesnt matter play with the other players . Even though we spent two hours for building and troops war is finish in 10 minutes. Most of the time overbalanced groups. Even though you said ballista and catapult is not fit the game they can bring new breath and strategy. This version of the game in this sense is very boring and we always do same thing. Built three stone maker, three woodcutter and so on...

3) if the walls are not appropriate and rejected as the idea, Why we see the walls already in there. Sometimes around the castles and the town there are walls. So how they are built. Even though the watch towers useless in some point. Somebody makes many axemen and enter the city very easily. So the walls are very necessary.

4) I didnt mean wood cutter catch them, just like a person wood cutter who can travel and locate the trees, a hunter can find and locate the animals and he can have his own house.

5) What ı mean by that we can travel behind the enemy by using ships and improve strategy quality. We can use them for many purposes.

6) Why it didnt fit, As you see the real cases in the war, a person who has more experience can last longer than the other soldiers.

s

I think you got a little to negative answer to your ideas, so let me try soften it and explain

1. We chose TSK as a source for KaM Remake because it is better thought through, balanced and carries bigger spirit. Most of the things added in TPR are not quite as well polished. So we thought we should stick to basics and add only those things that are perfect fit. Fishermans hut, Marketplace, Campaign. Mechanical war machines are not a perfect fit in balance and look'n'feel. It's arguable, but arguing itself means that they need a lot of work to make them to fit.

2. That depends on your playstyle, if your opponent was much weaker than you then you could kill him in 10min, right. Same goes vice versa. But if you are roughly in same league you can fight for longer. Play more defensively, leave troops to guard town when attacking the enemy, etc. I'm interested to hear suggestions on how to fix it.

3. Maybe we could add walls to counter #2.

4. Thats interesting, but it does not adds to game balance, we already have 4 types of food .. Sounds like a feature for the sake of adding new feature.

5. Idea is good, but as said - we miss good quality sprites and game mechanics.

6. Maybe.

All-in-all we have a buglist of ~50 issues, ~100 minor proposals and ~50 bigger ideas. It's very hard to make them all at once.

[Da Revolution]

about the points 4 and 5:

4. Are you able to draw it? If yes try to draw some in KaM style. As far as i know there isn't someone who takes care of sprites and stuff.

5. No it wouldn't be nice.