Balance testing release r4297

[The Dark Lord]

You're welcome. We've had this discussion before in a different topic.
He invested in a defence that often only covers a part of the entrance. If he made 30 towers you might have to empty ~5 of them completely to get past. If it was a very narrow entrance and you had to deal with more towers, then you might want to choose a different map if you can't deal with it.

[Sorcerer Kail]

Regarding builder rushes:
- Making towers ignore citizens (only kill warriors) is also unintuitive and there are some cases where you do want citizens killed.

What about simply allowing to choose if you want to kill citizens? This could be selected:
a) For each tower(could be too much clicking), by clicking on something like small serf(serf and stone) icon in tower menu?
b) Globally by clicking in any tower?
c) Combination of both - left click would select stance for one tower, right click for all of them.

[Bludmaster]

IMO stopping players from building fields won't work, since roads are almost as good. A few serfs and stones is a small price to pay for emptying the enemy's towers.

Lewin you didnt read it whole. This with combination of stop towers from shooting at builders.

Nissarin: I want to see player who dig fields before have even unlocked farm. And really you try to find problem where isnt.

Bo: Who said u must just past towers and let them shoot at your soldiers? They are not untouchable so you can destroy them with your range army!

[Bo_]

They are not untouchable so you can destroy them with your range army!

Yes because there's nothing more fun than destroying 30 towers, what almost takes no time.

[Nissarin]

IMO stopping players from building fields won't work, since roads are almost as good. A few serfs and stones is a small price to pay for emptying the enemy's towers.

Lewin you didnt read it whole. This with combination of stop towers from shooting at builders.

What if someone wants to scout the enemy using builders ? Have you ever saw enemy builder waiting for a stone in the entrance of your barracks ? Or making plans inside your base ? I bet you didn't..

Nissarin: I want to see player who dig fields before have even unlocked farm. And really you try to find problem where isnt.

I saw, many times and even did it myself. I can post you a replay from yesterday, where (at least) one of my allies made fields while farm was just a "plan" on the map, so even if I said it's a corner case I didn't meant it doesn't happen. And yes I try to find a problem, this is kinda my habit.

[Bludmaster]

What if someone wants to scout the enemy using builders ? Have you ever saw enemy builder waiting for a stone in the entrance of your barracks ? Or making plans inside your base ? I bet you didn't..

Scauting with roads is not really a good think, and its much easier with fields. And builder in entrance of barracks where already is a road? hmm i want to see it really . Making plans inside of base?? WTF? :-O Are you serious xDD All of this you can do easier with fields and only noobs do this before PT after PT u can easily defend yourself with soldiers!

I saw, many times and even did it myself. I can post you a replay from yesterday, where (at least) one of my allies made fields while farm was just a "plan" on the map, so even if I said it's a corner case I didn't meant it doesn't happen. And yes I try to find a problem, this is kinda my habit.

This is srupid not problem. Just your imagination that you need to make fields before farm is digged ..

Bo: Bo i dont think that is hard to make 30 militia and sacrifice them on these towers .. And destroy 30 towers? Come on if you can start game with players who did this you shouldnt be lazy to destroy them...

[Nissarin]

What if someone wants to scout the enemy using builders ? Have you ever saw enemy builder waiting for a stone in the entrance of your barracks ? Or making plans inside your base ? I bet you didn't..

You cant scaut that fast using roads instead of fields so this will help to solve this problem.

That depends on the distance between the bases, you can use towers as well and then use roads in the enemy base since there might not be enough space to make a plan.

And builder in entrance of barracks where already is a road? hmm i want to see it really .

Finished ? No you can't but you can block the building if it's just "in progress", besides even if it's finished you can still block it using building ("plan") if there is enough of space left.

Making plans inside of base?? WTF? :-O Are you serious xDD All of this you can do easier with fields and only noobs do this before PT after PT u can easily defend yourself with soldiers!

Using barracks or farms you can "block" lots of space at once.

FYI: this is all from experience, I didn't made this up, all of above happened to me or one of my allies in actual game.

This is srupid not problem. Just your imagination that you need to make fields before farm is digged ..

No, this is microing your builders. Digging fields take time, so if your builders doesn't have anything else to do they might as well dig the fields ahead of time.

[Bludmaster]

Nissarin can you tell me when you make your first farm? Because my builders are really bussy when I do my first one and same for everyplayer i play with.
If someon block your town before PT ends than he is noob and i will leave game .. And btw we dont talk about this here. We talk about builder rush. And how to stop doing it.

[Nissarin]

Nissarin can you tell me when you make your first farm? Because my builders are really bussy when I do my first one and same for everyplayer i play with.

That depends on PT and map (about of food, gold, materials) but it really boils down to the fact that just because you don't see a problem with that doesn't mean it's ok.

If someon block your town before PT ends than he is noob and i will leave game .. And btw we dont talk about this here. We talk about builder rush. And how to stop doing it.

Putting aside the fact that I don't like the idea of towers ignoring enemy units just as much as having unlimited ammo, since both seems unrealistic, you shouldn't ignore another issue just because it "solves" this one.

BTW: perhaps we should address the issue of tower spam before doing anything about "builder rush" ?

[Bludmaster]

That depends on PT and map (about of food, gold, materials) but it really boils down to the fact that just because you don't see a problem with that doesn't mean it's ok.

Putting aside the fact that I don't like the idea of towers ignoring enemy units just as much as having unlimited ammo, since both seems unrealistic, you shouldn't ignore another issue just because it "solves" this one.

Dont think its a problem and i want some other player to say its that big problem, because i dont know anybody who do anythink like making fields for farms before farm is even digged. And about unrealistic? When u have limited ammo i think that u will use it on soldiers not on some builders so it seems realistic to me. At least more than unlimited ammo. And btw tower spam is not big problem because you always can make militia or juest destroy them or help teammates but builder rush in our games is really devastating if you know how to use it.

[Lewin]

That depends on PT and map (about of food, gold, materials) but it really boils down to the fact that just because you don't see a problem with that doesn't mean it's ok.

Putting aside the fact that I don't like the idea of towers ignoring enemy units just as much as having unlimited ammo, since both seems unrealistic, you shouldn't ignore another issue just because it "solves" this one.

Dont think its a problem and i want some other player to say its that big problem, because i dont know anybody who do anythink like making fields for farms before farm is even digged.

I often make my fields before the farm is unlocked. Sometimes I plan where my farms will be early and so I get my builders to make fields while I'm waiting for serfs to deliver materials to building sites or if I'm waiting on stone to be mined or something (since fields are free to build so it's a good thing to do when you're short on building materials). Everyone has different playing styles, that's what makes the game good. If everyone was forced to play in the same way it wouldn't be as fun and interesting.

[vovets1]

So. Spears not useable now =) With 4297 people started make swordsmen, horses, axemen, archers, but people foggot about spears and maybe about pikes. It is problem =) What Developers will be do?

[pawel95]

So. Spears not useable now =) With 4297 people started make swordsmen, horses, axemen, archers, but people foggot about spears and maybe about pikes. It is problem =) What Developers will be do?

Well i disagree at this point. You are right that lances arent the only soldiertype now. However i can find now nearly all soldier types. Lances are often used with swordmen/knights and xbows/archers, but if you play with only rushers,it is clear that they arent any/not that much lancers/pikes, but this is only because of the game style i think.

[vovets1]

I am not rusher =) But i dont make spears =)

[pavlos]

the update when its come out?... sorry for asking.. but i have a stress about it....