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Wagons

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Krom

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KaM Remake Developer

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Post 19 Nov 2015, 11:58

Wagons

I want to discuss how wagons could work.

Wagons are there in KP to serve one main idea - to transport wares.

This implies a lot of uses:
- acquire wares from neutral territory (imagine a neutral barbarians camp in the wild, whoever controls it gets a wagon with 50 gold each 10 min)
- transport wares between own camps (e.g. bring 100 stone closer to a frontline camp)
- trade between players
- loot defeated players (e.g. destroying an enemies camp gives you 2 wagons with various loot that was inside)
- various scripted usages
- maybe even start new camps? (allow wagon to enter empty camp building grounds?)

That settled, there are ideas on how it could work:

It seems that wagons should be able to enter camps/stores, so that wares could be quickly injected into economy.
Looks like it is best if wagons could not be attacked, but can be captured easily - whoever walks near the wagon gains control over it.
Obviously no starving.

Wagons need to be filled with wares by player somehow (for trade / contributions):
- choose ware in wagon UI and let serfs do the loading?
- choose ware in camp/store UI and spawn a new wagon there?

Also wagons should be spawned into the world somehow:
- spawn from camp loaded with wares?
- spawn from market loaded with wares?
- made in siege workshop?

Wagons should not be used for scouting, so there should be some mechanism to prevent that:
- Maybe they cannot be commanded to drive to a point, but can only navigate between checkpoints (camp, market, neutral spot, etc)

Ideas are welcome )
Knights Province at: http://www.knightsprovince.com
KaM Remake at: http://www.kamremake.com
Original MBWR/WR2/AFC/FVR tools at: http://krom.reveur.de
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Lance Carrier

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Post 22 Nov 2015, 14:52

Re: Wagons

When you say "start new camps" I imagine that you mean "building a new base disconnected from the first".
In that case, should the wagon be used as a temporary warehouse/camp from which the wares are taken to build the new building or does it turn itself into a camp (perhaps it turns itself into "camp building marks" with all the necessary wares to be built by the builders...).

Ideas formulated as questions... :lol:

I agree that wagons should not be destroyed since... it is not "easy" to destroy 100 stones, etc.

About spawning, maybe a school-like button in the camp that consumes wood/clothes/¿horses?/¿cows? to make it in ~1min or whatever time/immediately.

If the wagon costs wares to make, then the process of loading it cannot imply making a free wagon. Maybe select the wares you want in the wagon itself and then select the warehouse where it can get them. It then enters the warehouse and loads.
Or maybe allow both methods: peasants may load/unload wagon (e.g. leave wagon next to butcher and peasants load sausages/chorizos :P directly).

I hope my bad ideas give you some good ideas!
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Krom

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Post 22 Nov 2015, 17:15

Re: Wagons

Yes, that is what I mean - starting a new base is an interesting concept worth trying )
Knights Province at: http://www.knightsprovince.com
KaM Remake at: http://www.kamremake.com
Original MBWR/WR2/AFC/FVR tools at: http://krom.reveur.de
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Esthlos

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Knight

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Post 22 Nov 2015, 18:59

Re: Wagons

Will serfs be assigned to their specific area, as in The Settlers, or will they travel freely between the bases as needed, as in KaM?

Also, I think it would be interesting if they could starve... as in, they need special food (maybe simply Corn?) that they automatically load when stopping at a warehouse that has some.

When they starve, they turn neutral.

Also, I think it would be cool, albait maybe complex, to give them drivers: when they spawn, they are empty but can get occupied like any building.

When you kill them (or they starve), they become empty and owned by whoever got any unit close enough: if you occupy them you can capture them. Or simply have your warriors destroy them (maybe thus turning their cargo into neutral resources like what you mentioned?).
Just when you think you know something, you have to look at it in another way, even though it may seem silly or wrong. You must try! - John Keating, "Dead Poets Society"
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Krom

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Post 22 Nov 2015, 19:29

Re: Wagons

I'm not sure if and how multi-base management will fit into KP, although it certainly has some nice use for campaign - imagine having 2 separate supply bases bringing you iron and gold ;-)

Thats what I was thinking for wagons too - whoever surrounds them - gains control over them )
Knights Province at: http://www.knightsprovince.com
KaM Remake at: http://www.kamremake.com
Original MBWR/WR2/AFC/FVR tools at: http://krom.reveur.de
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Lance Carrier

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Post 23 Nov 2015, 21:31

Re: Wagons

I like the idea of the wagon drivers, although it would take some "dynamism" away.
But I guess that KaM was never very "dynamic" :mrgreen:

Either a especial unit or any unit could drive the wagon, and the wagon comes out of the warehouse/school/whatever building where it is made already with a driver (but it consumes the ware needed to train one unit).
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zombie01

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Post 24 Nov 2015, 18:56

Re: Wagons

I think it's a bit of a trial and error to find the place for wagons..

All ideas sound good, but it's hard to know what will work and what won't
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Krom

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Post 25 Nov 2015, 04:59

Re: Wagons

I'm certain we can lock serfs to bases if they are isolated. But when the bases merge it may become complicated. I guess if bases are connected with at least 1 road - then can become merged and all serfs and everything becomes "common".
Knights Province at: http://www.knightsprovince.com
KaM Remake at: http://www.kamremake.com
Original MBWR/WR2/AFC/FVR tools at: http://krom.reveur.de
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dicsoupcan

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Post 30 Nov 2015, 13:32

Re: Wagons

Wel you could move wagons freely and give it a line of sight so low it needs an escort to see where it can go.
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. ~ Winston Churchill
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Moist Face

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Post 26 Dec 2015, 12:09

Re: Wagons

Krom wrote:Also wagons should be spawned into the world somehow:
- spawn from camp loaded with wares?
- spawn from market loaded with wares?
- made in siege workshop?


Siege workshop?!?!?! Does this mean catapults are planned? :rolleyes:
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Krom

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Post 26 Dec 2015, 12:36

Re: Wagons

Yes, I hope KP will have siege machines
Knights Province at: http://www.knightsprovince.com
KaM Remake at: http://www.kamremake.com
Original MBWR/WR2/AFC/FVR tools at: http://krom.reveur.de
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Lance Carrier

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Post 03 Jan 2016, 12:01

Re: Wagons

Krom wrote:I'm certain we can lock serfs to bases if they are isolated. But when the bases merge it may become complicated. I guess if bases are connected with at least 1 road - then can become merged and all serfs and everything becomes "common".


Regarding this, it may be reasonable to assign some kind of variable to the buildings, related to the first warehouse they were connected to.
That way you could assign serfs to different connected cities and require wagons to transport wares between them even if they are connected by a road (or maybe there is a better solution...).
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Krom

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Post 03 Jan 2016, 12:53

Re: Wagons

That sounds much like having just 2-3 hands (players towns) being able to be controlled by 1 human player.
Knights Province at: http://www.knightsprovince.com
KaM Remake at: http://www.kamremake.com
Original MBWR/WR2/AFC/FVR tools at: http://krom.reveur.de
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Lance Carrier

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Post 03 Jan 2016, 18:06

Re: Wagons

Krom wrote:That sounds much like having just 2-3 hands (players towns) being able to be controlled by 1 human player.


Yes, I thought that was the plan, to allow this :)

I don't know what you have in mind, but it may be easier, as I think you are saying, to allow one player to control various different players somehow (like starcraft or warcraft do when an ally leaves the multiplayer game) instead of making everything belong to the same player directly.

In that case maybe the "hand" could change after you select a player or building belonging to the other player-controlled city.

But well, we were talking about wagons :lol:

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