Is there a log of changes made to the original?

[Drakken]

The title says it all. I need to check a change log to see how this game has been modified. I appreciate all of the work done to make this game run on current hardware. But alas, I am not happy with the results.

I have become depressed by playing this game multiplayer a few times. It has been a couple of years since I have played the game. However, I do not remember being able to recruit hundreds of carriers and workers and be able to feed them all with a small handful of farms. It seems to me that food has been made to be almost unimportant in the game.

[Ben]

Food is the same as it was in TSK and TPR, with the exception that farmers have improved AI which makes them more efficient. Some people are talking about increasing the growth rate of corn to compensate for this.

However, I do not remember being able to recruit hundreds of carriers and workers and be able to feed them all with a small handful of farms.

Do you exaggerate on purpose? With a city of 75 buildings, 80 serfs, and 20 laborers, you'll need at least seven farms to feed all them if you go for leather. That's not exactly a "small handful." Perhaps you made twenty farms in TSK/TPR? If so, I can also bet that they were placed badly and that the inferior farmer AI really started to stack over all these farms.

I don't know where the changelog is, but I believe that it was somewhere on http://code.google.com/p/castlesand. Be aware that it is very hard to read.

[Lewin]

We don't have a changelog because we never "changed" the original game, we completely rewrote the entire thing from scratch without any access to the original source code. There are lots of aspects of the game where we just don't know exactly how they work, or we/others have guessed how they work (e.g. projectiles). For these reason it's not really possible to make a changelog.

That said, we have made a few intentional changes (but not to food as you suggested). We made ranged units less deadly because when we made them similar to the original game, every multiplayer game resulted in people making only ranged units and a few milita to protect them. All other melee units were basically useless because they would be killed by ranged units so quickly.

It is my belief that the original game was never well balanced for multiplayer, since multiplayer was buggy in it (completely broken in TPR) and the developers couldn't have balanced it without playing it a lot and getting lots of feedback. I therefore don't think it's a problem if we make small adjustments in order to improve multiplayer without changing the spirit or style of the game.

[Bence791]

I must say Drakken is right about food. Ben, in TPR, 9 farms arent enough to feed an economy (despite they are faster), while having no stables and no fishers/vineyards. Having 15 labours+60-65 serfs. But imo it isn't a kinda problem since everyone had to build vineyards before gold production... And also, mills before pigfarms. That results in pretty little (or no) army in pt, because it delays everything.

[T*AnTi-V!RuZz]

I'm planning on making a page on our website which describes all differences between KaM TSK/TPR and the Remake.

[Bence791]

I could help you with that

[T*AnTi-V!RuZz]

I could help you with that

That would be great! Maybe you and dicsoupcan could work together since he was prepared to help update the website, but I don't know if he wants to do this.

Please contact him and then let me know. I can set you guys up.

[thunder]

I must say Drakken is right about food. Ben, in TPR, 9 farms arent enough to feed an economy (despite they are faster), while having no stables and no fishers/vineyards. Having 15 labours+60-65 serfs. But imo it isn't a kinda problem since everyone had to build vineyards before gold production... And also, mills before pigfarms. That results in pretty little (or no) army in pt, because it delays everything.

Yes. And what about the iron?;)

[Krom]

@Tom: Having such a list would be great

Food was tweaked a little, e.g. we reduced required number of winefields per wineyard to make the wine more balanced corresponding to its food value.

[dicsoupcan]

@Tom: Having such a list would be great

Food was tweaked a little, e.g. we reduced required number of winefields per wineyard to make the wine more balanced corresponding to its food value.

And offcourse the farmpatch which made corn production more effecient.

[Bence791]

In TPR, farms are just as good (or better) as in the remake. And Krom, no, I didnt actually mean that, but that people (in TPR) eat either more or more frequently, I guess the first option, since given ones become hungry approx at the same time they do in the remake.

[Drakken]

Thanks for the info guys. It just seems in the original feeding 20 builders, 80 carriers, and a productive town required 10-12 farms which there rarely was room for.

I would absolutely love a mod that required you to feed troops as soon as you build them. I wouldn't want to manually feed with carriers, but they would subtract food stores as you built them. It would make an efficient and productive town more important. As it is right now I see the best players just build things anywhere. All that matters is speed and not efficiency. Since it is so easy to feed the populace there is really no strain on the economy in my opinion.

[Krom]

@Drakken: That is a little different topic

It is very hard to balance something and don't get a ton of negative feedback ("omg, WHY did they changed THIS to worse?"). Unless there's a serious issue (e.g. arbaletmen being unused in recent release) I don't think it will be a good idea to do a change.