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The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

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Killer!!

Sword Fighter

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Post 12 Mar 2015, 16:50

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Atm we are having a discussion about it on TS, it´s really hard, but their will probably be changed something.... Please give ous some time to organise it as good as possible
Do you want to play with/against me? Just write me a PM :D
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Ultimate Team Tour

Bowman

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Post 12 Mar 2015, 17:07

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

PLEASE EVERYONE DON'T PLAY ANY GAMES YET! I AM SAD TO TELL THAT THERE ARE SOME PROBLEMS WITH THE CURRENT SYSTEM WE ARE USING, WE ARE FIXING THIS AS FAST AS POSSIBLE, AFTER THIS THERE WILL BE GIVEN MORE INFORMATION AND THE DEADLINE WILL BE EDITED!

I'M REALLY SORRY FOR THIS,

The Ultimate Team Tour
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Ultimate Team Tour

Bowman

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Post 12 Mar 2015, 22:09

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Hello dear paricipants,

I am so sorry about today, but we had to change the tournament table because it wasn't really fair as it was before.

So now I present you the new Tournament Table in the attachments of the first post, as you can see the matches stay's the same as they were drawn.

The only thing which is different is they way the loser's bracket works, now you can advance to the loser's bracket from any round in the winner's ladder, if you lose a game there (only not in semi, and finals) so now people won't think about "loosing first game on purpose to avoid better teams".

The only thing we couldn't avoid, is that there will be 1 "Unlucky Loser" after the second round of the loser's ladder, this team will be drawn on my twitch account again when we will be at that stage of the tournament.
(if you don't understand it just look at the tournament table, it would help you understanding it).

Again I want to apologize for this issue today.

One last thing, I want to thank Don Artie, Romek, Mexican T and Sado for helping me on this new ladder and explaining how it works. You guys are awesome, really well done! :)

Enjoy your games! :)

The Ultimate Team Tournament
Last edited by Ultimate Team Tour on 13 Mar 2015, 10:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Jeronimo

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 00:20

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Ultimate Team Tour wrote:The only thing which is different is they way the loser's bracket works, now you can advance to the loser's bracket from any round in the winner's ladder, if you lose a game there (only not in semi, and finals) so now people won't think about "loosing first game on purpose to avoid better teams".

The new format only increases the risks that tournament will fail. Too long with all those new matches at the losers bracket.

The previous format (original in Powah 2012), had everything covered.
The logic behind "loosing first game on purpose to avoid better teams" it's a superstition.
2 strong teams thinking/acting that way, will end meeting in the losers bracket. No advantage.

The disadvantage on losers bracket is that you play additional stage to pass to finals.
People keeps understimating "average" teams. If any of those games they decide to get 30 knights each one and rush closest base... How will you stop them? Anyone can win with fast victory strategies. This is tournament, not random game.

The worse worse teams wouldn't pass first losers game. After that... How much advantage you say you can have over remaining teams? There is indeed too much superstition around logics (I recall the bad change on Map picking rules).
KaM Skill Level: Jeronimo
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thunder

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 08:00

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Good morning,
Well I complete disagree with this new system but okay let play this.
JUST ONE small thing!!!
This is more unfair system as previous was. You have to change the loserbracket team sheulde. Need to make crossfading the teams. Who lost on the top bracket that has to play with bottom bracket looser. Should to crossfading as normal. Each Darts and tablefootball grandprix event here have this kind of loser bracket and crossfadingsystem here in HUN.

For example we lost in the first round Me and Boci((but i cant imagine this situation (H) ) After win a game on loser bracket and Destah and Mexi win his first game and lost their second game then our 3rd game will be again together....
Now this seems for me a b******t system how you guys found out !!! If i would like to play with only Mexi t and Destah i dont sign up to this tournament :mrgreen:
Solution:
Just relocate the loserbracket teams!!
Loser 1 play loser 12
Loser2 play loser 11
loser 3 play loser 10
loser 4 play loser 9 etc....

This is a normal normal process. You need to use the crossing. (Worldcup systems have also crossing)

It is your decision.


PS: for this kind of loser bracket if you would like trust then should to use 32 teams bracket and make 8 locations empty and then there will be some team who is called "erőnyerő"-power/lucky winner- but after the bracket 16 will be fine evrything.... This is a very poor bracket form. But this is my opinion. So lets play it :)
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sado1

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 08:05

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Jeronimo wrote:The previous format (original in Powah 2012), had everything covered.
The logic behind "loosing first game on purpose to avoid better teams" it's a superstition.
2 strong teams thinking/acting that way, will end meeting in the losers bracket. No advantage.

You forget that there's only two teams which are most likely to win this. They can easily either make an agreement, or simply wait for the other team to play first, then win/lose depending on the need. Especially that this is the only way they'd avoid meeting in quarterfinals. I don't think this shows that those two teams are trying to break the tournament or something, though, seeing as those two teams were pushing for this change the most - so they don't have to stand in front of a morally inacceptable choice, right from the start.
Jeronimo wrote:The new format only increases the risks that tournament will fail. Too long with all those new matches at the losers bracket.
There is a problem with making a 24-team tournament ladder that would be efficient. The only I can think of, would be single elimination converting it into 16-team tournament (16 teams play qualification stage first, then the winners play against 8 remaining lucky teams). At least, current system is fair for sure, and I prefer it over the Powah one, but there indeed might be a problem with people losing interest early on. Let's hope that the loser bracket will work this time, seeing as it lets teams get back to the semi-finals.
There's one huge problem though, but we are probably completely unable to resolve it - after quarterfinals, the losers need to play THREE! games before the winner semifinals can start... deleting losers from G, H, I is not an option, since (especially that we know one of them would be Romo+koczis/MexT+Destah) it'd be slightly unfair to kick the losers out so early.
Ultimate Team Tour wrote:MESSAGE TO ALL STREAMERS!
Could you please post a comment here below of the games you will be streaming? So I can keep an eye on it and we all know which games will be streamed and which not. :)
There's a problem with that, at least for me, seeing as
-I almost never know when I will be able to stream (apart from that it usually will happen after 19-21 CET)
-we don't know when any games are going to be played, so how can we tell you when we will stream them
I agree that streaming times need to be known in advance, to get as many viewers as possible, but it's hard to do that. My solution was usually posting it on KaM World on Facebook (this fanpage came into existence because it wasn't easy to notify people about the streams quickly enough), forum minichat, and spamming everyone on TS. (Hey, we totally need an embedded Twitch/Hitbox/etc. viewer/"channels list" builtin into the next Remake release :D)

Vovets - please contact me about getting permissions to make posts on KaM World facebook page. Ben: please start using your permissions :P

I agree with Thunder about "crossfading" if that's the correct word :P
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Ultimate Team Tour

Bowman

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 10:15

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

@Thunder I agree, thanks that you saw this issue of the tournament table, I will immediately change this in the table.
Luckily you saw this in time, if you would have said this after the first games would be played it wouldn't be possible anymore :)
I will make a new post about this when i finished the small changes to the table :)

GL and thanks a lot!

@Sado About streaming, I think you should just ask some teams when they planned to play their game, and if they allow you to stream it.
If you just ask people when they play you can just see it yourself if you will have the time to stream it.
Or maybe even better, should I (or you) make a topic on this forum somewhere where people can make a comment with the exact date of their game?
Not everyone has to do this but only the players who wants their games to be streamed, and you can just look at these dates, if you have time and if you would enjoy streaming these.

The Ultimate Team Tour
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Ultimate Team Tour

Bowman

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 10:28

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Hello participants,

There has been a little change to the tournament taable. (I know it happens to often :()
The reason why I changed it a bit was because of the reason Thunder did write (take a look at it if you want)

So what is changed?
Well the only thing which is changed is that the games in the loser's bracked first round are now "crossed" which means Loser 1 vs Loser 12 instead of Loser 1 vs Loser 2 for example.
This is done because otherwise their would be a chance you would play they same opponents twice in to few games, doing it this way you would face them much later, which makes the tournament in most peoples view more fun!

In the second round of the tournament i didn't cross the loser's from A until F but I just made them in a random way, otherwise we would still have the same problem with playing the same opponents in to short time.

I have updated the tournament table so take a look at it, if there are things unclear just ask me :)

I hope we can finally enjoy they tournament ;)

The Ultimate Team Tour

NEW TOURNAMENT TABLE LINK: https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1m6- ... sp=sharing
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sado1

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 14:37

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Ultimate Team Tour wrote:If you just ask people when they play you can just see it yourself if you will have the time to stream it.
Or maybe even better, should I (or you) make a topic on this forum somewhere where people can make a comment with the exact date of their game?
Not everyone has to do this but only the players who wants their games to be streamed, and you can just look at these dates, if you have time and if you would enjoy streaming these.

The Ultimate Team Tour

The problem is, I have no idea when I will have time before the very day of the game. Most likely every day after 20:00 should be fine for me, but there will be days when I won't be able, and I don't want to tell everyone I will make a stream, but then I will be late or unable to join at all, and everyone will be angry at me. I can stream only if I can do it whenever I have time.

Also, people won't care about such topic because people never do something they think is unnecessary for their participation, even if you make it a requirement they won't do that - trust me on that one :P
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Ben

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 19:49

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

I also cannot say which games I can stream and which ones I can't. Teams will likely have some difficulty playing each other already, let alone with streamers. Also remember that I am in a substantially different timezone than you (I think this time of year I am -5 hours from CET) so it can be tricky for me to get into a game.
#thunderposting #greentornado
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Ultimate Team Tour

Bowman

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Post 13 Mar 2015, 19:53

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Ok, streams are a added bonus to the tournament anyway, if we would get some it would be nice and otherwise it's a shame but it doesn't really matter ;)
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Ben

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Post 14 Mar 2015, 04:29

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

My new predictions. Note these were made after the first game (Redbull and Blackbull loss) was played :P
Image

Yeah probably nobody cares but I'll give you my reasoning:

Round #1: Nothing too interesting happens in the first round. Standard expectations

LRound #1: Again nothing crazy

Round #2: Mexican's team beats TRB's team without too much troubles. I think there will be an upset and I think the most likely case is with Siem's team! Siem has a good game and Jero's PT army is competent. After trying to kill Jero off too early to avoid crazy spam, Launger makes a mistake in fighting. After heavy losses, they cannot survive the spam from Jero.

LReound #2: Nothing interesting. Rom's team is unlucky after winning ((shouldn't have put Kamy's team in unlucky but oh well) unlucky team picked from a random pick simulator).

Round #3: Mexican's team cannot compete with the combined Polish rage of Romek and Koczis. Game ends after before 1:20:00 after really big fight.

LRound #3: A rematch between the Dutch boys Artie and TRB and Mexican's gang. However, this game is very close, at least in numbers, but TRB's team again losses since they don't use microphones. Mexican's leadership helps secure another win. Sado and Autentic have the second upset in the tour in their favor. They both play competent and Krolik does well, but Janek makes a small mistake in building that causes him to have mediocre army for his standards (17 swords, less than 6 knights, 22 bowmen).

LRound #4: Sado and Authentic had impressive run in tour, but fall terribly short this time. Sado feels too much pressure after getting so far (and playing far superior opponents) and has a bad game. Mexican and Destah clean up.

LFinal: I'm unsure of this one, but I believe Mexican and Destah win. Launger's team is slightly behind in numbers after Mexican and Destah have impressive PT armies.

Round #4: Jero's spam strategy is no match against both Koczis and Romek. Easy win for the Polish

THE BIG FINAL: Romek and Koczis all the way. PT armies are very comparable, but the Polish communicate better and work better together. Romek's base is good lategame, too, so Mexican and Destah take second place.

Well there you have it :D Making early predictions is my favorite part of a tour xD
P.S., I was a little confused about how the loser's bracket works after unlucky draw. Let me know if I screwed up so I can amend it :):)
#thunderposting #greentornado
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kocsis1david

Crossbowman

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Post 14 Mar 2015, 07:49

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Marines please answer my private message.
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Airo

Serf

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Post 14 Mar 2015, 21:45

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

Hello Guys can u send me pw, when u will play ?

i mean The Architect & OHO
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kocsis1david

Crossbowman

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Post 15 Mar 2015, 05:59

Re: The Ultimate Team Tournament (2v2) 2015!

It's possible that we're going to need a reserve team.
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