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Regeneration of lifepoints

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Lewin

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KaM Remake Developer

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Joined: 16 Sep 2007, 22:00

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Website: http://lewin.hodgman.id.au

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Location: Australia

Post 09 Dec 2011, 13:15

Hey Humbelum,
We have actually increased the hit point restore time to 10 seconds, because 1vs1 battles with scouts lasted for 15 minutes in the Remake using 4 seconds!! In KaM they last for 1 minute or so. Using 10 second regeneration time we found the battle time for 1vs1 scouts matched KaM closely, so we're using that.
I think there might be other errors in the fighting system calculation because battles still don't feel exactly the same, maybe the German guidebook had some minor mistakes?
I think we will never get fights exact, the most important thing is that it is balanced and feels correct. We will keep tweaking it, but we want to see how the 10 seconds restore rate goes in the new build before we change anything else.

By the way, the method you used to calculate it does not prove that it is 4 seconds, one of our other assumptions could be wrong. For example, the counter to reset hitpoints could be running continuously, so every 10 seconds of gameplay, all units gain 1 HP. This means sometimes, the fight would start just before the scout gained a HP and thus it could take 5 strokes. There are a lot of unknowns, we need lots of tests to prove anything I guess :(
What I know for sure is that 1vs1 scout battles should not last 15 minutes (that's easy to prove in KaM) so we changed it to 10 seconds for that reason. We'll welcome any further research into the KaM fighting system that you make :)
Lewin.
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dicsoupcan

Moorbach's Guard

Posts: 1314

Joined: 12 Feb 2012, 21:36

KaM Skill Level: Fair

Post 14 Feb 2012, 15:05

Re:

I thought about the hitpoints again and think, that it would be possible to calculate the recovering rate with a few different scenarios.
Yes we could, if someone would like to collect this data then please do so and I can help with the analysis.
Logically this would mean that hitpoints don't recover during the formation is engaged in battle.
We have very good reasons to believe that hitpoints do recover during battles. I set the remake to not recover hitpoints then sent 15 scouts against 15 other scouts, with code in place to time the duration of each battle (down to 1 tick :P) Without hitpoint recovery the last scout died at 34 seconds, and the first one died at 17 seconds. I ran the same mission in KaM, and there were still scouts alive at around 1 minute. The first one died at 24 seconds. This strongly suggests that hit points recover during fights, or if they do not then there is something else seriously wrong with our fighting system interpretation.
By using a recovery rate of 10 seconds the results seem pretty similar to KaM but I have not done a detailed analysis due to lack of time.
i can try to make simulations by making scenarios in the map editor and posting the data if you still want?
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. ~ Winston Churchill
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Lewin

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KaM Remake Developer

Posts: 3822

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Location: Australia

Post 15 Feb 2012, 06:28

Re: Re:

i can try to make simulations by making scenarios in the map editor and posting the data if you still want?
Sure, any data gathered from KaM TPR/TSK could be helpful :)
Obviously we don't need data gathered from the Remake, since we know what the code does.
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dicsoupcan

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Joined: 12 Feb 2012, 21:36

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Post 15 Feb 2012, 14:43

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

okay i've been busy all afternoon operating my ideas on gathering data, my first idea to play a single map in tpr, using the goods cheat, own the enemy's army and then fight the soldiers the enemey recruit one by one with different soldiers did absolutely not work. This did not work because:
- they recruited too fast so i ended up fighting more units;
- their ally came to help (never seen that before?).

so after my badly planned idea i thought to make my own map with all the units in place, and just make some test runs with different combinations. i made a map in the remake in-built editor and tried to install it in tpr somehow, but all i did was destroy my game. so when i am reinstalling tpr i want to know if it is even possible to implement a custom map?( i noticed the remake makes a .dat .map and a .txt file and tpr has only .dat and .map and that makes me think it is not possible).
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. ~ Winston Churchill
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Wesley762

Militia

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Joined: 06 Feb 2012, 12:04

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Location: Netherlands

Post 15 Feb 2012, 15:47

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

Yes you can play custom maps.
most of the maps you see in this remake are custom tbh.
But the ingame editor isnt finished yet.

1. Make your terrain with Krom's Editor

2. then make your mission on your new map (placing soldiers for your test etc) with Lewin's Mission Editor
You can find instructions on how to do that in Lewin's Mission editor's help section.

3. Make sure both the .map (from Krom's Editor) and the .dat (Lewin's Mission editor) are in a map togther and all named the same.
for example : "testmission.map" and "testmission.dat" placed in a map called "testmission".

4. place your map "testmission" in KAM REMAKE\MPmaps OR KAM REMAKE\Maps

5. depending on where you placed it you can now find your map in the KAM Remake under multiplayer or singleplayer Ingame.

6. Enjoy your testing.
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dicsoupcan

Moorbach's Guard

Posts: 1314

Joined: 12 Feb 2012, 21:36

KaM Skill Level: Fair

Post 15 Feb 2012, 15:55

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

although i really appreciate the explenation( i will be using this in the futur for the remake), i just wanted to know if it was possible to make a custom map in the original the peasants rebellion game, so i can test how the units will fight by making combat situations( like 1 vs 1 militia, 2 militia vs 1 axe etc etc etc..)

for now i have messed up the game probably because i messed wit the files to much^^
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. ~ Winston Churchill
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Wesley762

Militia

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Location: Netherlands

Post 15 Feb 2012, 15:58

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

this will also work for the normal game. you can just put your custom maps in either remake or the original version.
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caykroyd

Crossbowman

Posts: 228

Joined: 27 Nov 2011, 23:00

Location: Brazil

Post 15 Feb 2012, 18:07

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

this will also work for the normal game. you can just put your custom maps in either remake or the original version.
i think you have to rename some old files from the tpr/tsk to be able to play custom maps;
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Wesley762

Militia

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Joined: 06 Feb 2012, 12:04

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Location: Netherlands

Post 15 Feb 2012, 18:19

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

ah that could be im not familier with this.
i just used to use the slots from the Singleplayer maps naming my custom map the same as the tutorial for example and replaced it.
or atleast thats how i used to do it.
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caykroyd

Crossbowman

Posts: 228

Joined: 27 Nov 2011, 23:00

Location: Brazil

Post 15 Feb 2012, 19:39

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

ah that could be im not familier with this.
i just used to use the slots from the Singleplayer maps naming my custom map the same as the tutorial for example and replaced it.
or atleast thats how i used to do it.
yep, thats what i meant :mrgreen:
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Lewin

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KaM Remake Developer

Posts: 3822

Joined: 16 Sep 2007, 22:00

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Website: http://lewin.hodgman.id.au

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Location: Australia

Post 15 Feb 2012, 21:41

Re: Regeneration of lifepoints

As Wesley762 suggested, use Krom's map editor and my mission editor. If you look in the help file of my mission editor there is a section called something like Getting Started - Playing your mission which explains where to put files and what to name them. Basically make the map first then make the mission. The mission file needs to specific the map, or it could use one of the original maps instead.

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