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Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 13:29
by Plaguesworn
Hello,
I wanted to play "Stuck in the Middle again", a mission created by Matt back in the day for TPR. However it is
unplayable in KAM Remake. e.g. blue player attacks you istead of the black player, black player totally annihilates
the blue player in approximately 2 attacks, etc.
Would anybody be interested in fixing this mission? I was quite fond of it actually.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 13:46
by Vatrix
I'm little busy with fixing TPR campaign at the moment, but if you describe me exactly how this mission worked in original, I can look into it later.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 13:50
by thibmo
Hello,
I wanted to play "Stuck in the Middle again", a mission created by Matt back in the day for TPR. However it is
unplayable in KAM Remake. e.g. blue player attacks you istead of the black player, black player totally annihilates
the blue player in approximately 2 attacks, etc.
Would anybody be interested in fixing this mission? I was quite fond of it actually.
Working on it, bro.
There are some static attacks set but they are set to "closest building" rather then a proper loc.
Also soldier count is somewhat low for blue.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 14:06
by Plaguesworn
Hello,
the main principal idea of said mission was that the blue player launches attacks on the black player and visa versa. Also
the orange player launches attacks on the cream coloured player and visa versa. In TPR the attacks appear to be much more
frequent then one would encounter in the remake. Therefore in TPR hostile soldiers were constantly marching very close
to your village, making it difficult to expand, without making a stand for it.
Furthermore in TPR neither of the previously mentioned 4 coloured players could defeat one another, you, the green player
should aid in a siege to take down a player. How the mission currently plays out in the Remake, you can just do nothing at
all and those 4 players would just destroy one another.
Additionally in TPR if one of those 4 players would be destroyed, the victor would then proceed to besiege one of the remaining
2 players, but not you, i.e. the green player. They would only be interested in seeking a quarrel with you once you are the only
remaining opposing player to them.
I hope this allows one to get a bit of a grasp on what is supposed to be going on. I can't describe it 100%, so one could definitly
check how it behaves in detail in TPR.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 15:01
by thibmo
Hello,
the main principal idea of said mission was that the blue player launches attacks on the black player and visa versa. Also
the orange player launches attacks on the cream coloured player and visa versa. In TPR the attacks appear to be much more
frequent then one would encounter in the remake. Therefore in TPR hostile soldiers were constantly marching very close
to your village, making it difficult to expand, without making a stand for it.
Furthermore in TPR neither of the previously mentioned 4 coloured players could defeat one another, you, the green player
should aid in a siege to take down a player. How the mission currently plays out in the Remake, you can just do nothing at
all and those 4 players would just destroy one another.
Additionally in TPR if one of those 4 players would be destroyed, the victor would then proceed to besiege one of the remaining
2 players, but not you, i.e. the green player. They would only be interested in seeking a quarrel with you once you are the only
remaining opposing player to them.
I hope this allows one to get a bit of a grasp on what is supposed to be going on. I can't describe it 100%, so one could definitly
check how it behaves in detail in TPR.
Gave it all a good check and found the story:
- Code:
I have found out that there are no alliances between the four kingdoms in this land,in fact,
we have built our town in the middle of a war zone that has dragged on for decades.
I did find a small tribe just to the east of our location. They have not welcomed our
presence and have declared they will fight against you for their land. (Brown team)
The kingdom to the east of us (White team) have a well established town protected by high
walls and towers. They have been at war with the kingdom to the west (Red Team)in an
attempt to take over the rich gold mines in the volcanic mountain located in the north west.
To access the western kingdom you must cross a bridge over a lava flow. These two kingdoms
are constantly sending armies to attack each other.
The Kingdom to the north (Black Team) have a town that is only accessible via a footbridge
over a deep, dark canyon. They are the only kingdom with Enough room to accomodate horses.
They have been at war with the kingdom on a small island south of our location (blue team)
because they want access to the large quantities of coal located on the island. The island
can be accessed by a small bridge linking it to the main land. These two kingdoms will
frequently send armies to attack each other.
I have found out that although each kingdom seems to have one enemy they really dislike,
they will attack other armies that they contact.
I have discovered that these four kingdoms will not consider attacking us until they
have destroyed their original enemies. However they will not hesitate to destroy our troops
and citizens that get in their way.
As they would totally wreck you from point 0(and always attack the nearest city) I now set some initial delays to give the player a chance. Every 5 minutes one of the AI attacks the opponent.
Brown immediately gives you trouble but you should now be able to survive this.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 15:16
by Vatrix
Ok ok, no rush
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 15:33
by Plaguesworn
Hello,
the brown opponent doesn't seem to behave much different. He was always very easy to defeat. What concerns me more is the disturbed behaviors
of the cream player, the orange player, the blue player and the black player. Also it appears that the colours are displayed incorrect in KAM Remake.
They are roughly similar, but all colours are off, e.g. the human players green is far too bright, the blue player is has a very dark shade to it, near
purple, the orange player has a more redish tone to it, etc.
Also in TPR sometimes advanding armies would clash with one another, even though they were not out to seek and destroy one another. This often
happened right below your village, in the fight killing many of your citizens.
Could it be that the 4 rival kingdoms equiped soldiers faster in TPR due to its continues stream of marching soldiers on the map? Expecially the blue
player must have equiped soldiers faster then let's say the black player I think.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 15:39
by Tiank
They are roughly similar, but all colours are off, e.g. the human players green is far too bright, the blue player is has a very dark shade to it, near
purple, the orange player has a more redish tone to it, etc.
That's because colour palette is different in newest KMR release. See this
link for more info. But I don't see it as a problem in this mission
I can't help with other stuff though, just wanted to make colours case straight.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 16:18
by thibmo
I hope this will do for now.
Don't have the time to make a full dynamic script right now I am afraid. :/
* Colors fixed
* Attacking fixed(Mostly)
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 11 Aug 2015, 16:34
by Vatrix
This map was very interesting back in the days of original KaM. I like that someone took care of the scripting part of it, but it also needs a big terrain and look improvement, then it could be added back to KaM Remake. It has a big potential, isn't someone interested?
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 16 Aug 2015, 17:13
by Plaguesworn
Hello,
I played the modified version for a couple of days and it's definitely an improvement, but it still has it's flaws. But as you
lacked the time to compare it extensively to it's TPR counterpart, it's at least playable in K&M Remake now.
Re: Stuck in the Middle fix?
PostPosted: 13 Sep 2020, 14:33
by Alanbach
Thank You, I was searching for this mission since ages. Couldn't to find it on any of KAM service with missions.